Event Sales Masterclass With Mr. Berg

Jared Judge 0:02

What's up ? Denver Event Professionals ? Welcome back to another episode of the Denver NACE Podcast where you'll learn amazing tips , tricks and tools to help you grow your events business here in Denver , brought to you by our local chapter of the National Association for Catering and Events . I am your host , jared Judge , founder and music director of Extreme Strings Electric Violins . I am super excited today to bring a special guest who you probably have heard his name several times . You've probably encountered him , you know , maybe through your experience through WeddingPro , perhaps through his podcast , wedding Business Solutions , or maybe a sales training session . So welcome , please . Alan Berg . Thanks so much for being here .

Alan Berg 0:48

Thanks for inviting me , jared . It's great . I love NACE and I love that I'm getting to come back out , because it's been way too long since I've been in Denver , or , as I say , it was BC before COVID .

Jared Judge 0:57

Oh , yes , for sure . Well , we are so excited to have you , and we're especially excited because you are coming and delivering a masterclass for our chapter and invited guests on April 9th at the Gaylord Rockies Hotel and Convention Center . Would you mind telling us a bit about what we can expect at this April 9th event ?

Alan Berg 1:18

Absolutely , and I love that property as well , because the last time I was in Denver actually wasn't that property , and I'm going to be there twice this year because National Speakers Association is having our event there as well . So a masterclass , different than just the presentation which I'll be doing at the evening meeting , I'll be doing a presentation called your Brand Is More Than your Logo , and that meeting is what you typically would expect . You're going to come and you can do networking . You're going to eat , you're going to hear a presentation , that one is going to talk about how branding is different than your brand , and really to understand your brand is to understand you why . So that's the evening part . So you can probably picture that , although you may not picture me there because you might have seen me at the wedding MBA or some big stage like that , but I'm coming to you for that . But that afternoon we're doing something really cool which is a masterclass , and what a masterclass is different is its presentations . But it's a longer session because we get to dive deeper into those things . I want you to actually be not just taking notes , but taking action right there . So we're going to be talking about from the inquiry to the sale .

Alan Berg 2:22

And this is where the rubber meets the road , where you and I were talking offline about how the business of whatever it is you do is different than the craft of what you do . And that's the thing with the wedding and event industry . Back in my days when I was VP of sales at the knot , and even before that when I was publishing wedding magazines , I ran into so many creative people and continue to run into so many creative people . But creative people don't necessarily have business skills . They have creative skills , right . So the creative skill that makes you a great fill in the blank photographer , florist , band DJ , dress designer , caterer , whatever it is you do those skills are different than the skills you need to sell . So , once you get that inquiry right , there's four steps to getting more sales get their attention , get an inquiry , have a conversation , make a sale . I don't care what you're selling , it's the same four steps . You could be selling airplanes , it's the same four steps there . So , through that , what I'm going to take you through is , when you get that inquiry , how do you have a better conversation so you get ghosted less ? That's one of the biggest frustrations I hear from people . I get the inquiry , I respond as quickly as I can . Nothing , that's it . I don't hear back .

Alan Berg 3:32

I had an email from a client of mine in California through one of the platform she's advertising and they only let her reply once . And I've taught her to reply four , five , six , seven times and she's like what do I do ? I'm only allowed to reply once . I was like find a different platform . I mean right , right , you know , because it's crazy that they're only letting her reply once , when we know that the customer , the way customers respond , and when we're customers we do the same thing . You inquire with someone , they respond . You may not be available to reply when they respond . And now , when you put yourself back at the top of their inbox or their messaging box or their text box or on the not wedding wire , instagram , facebook , you know , go down the line . You now have their attention again . And very few people in our industry are already doing cold calling . I would imagine with NACE there probably aren't that many people out there doing cold calling .

Jared Judge 4:23

Probably not .

Alan Berg 4:25

Yeah , and I've done that . I did 10 years worth of cold calling . I went from being an inside sales to being 10 years driving around knocking on doors like yours , doing cold calling . And the challenge with cold calling is , even if you do it smarter , you don't know if they need what you do . Right , you can say this is a business in this industry and , yes , they're doing things like this . But did they need you today ? I don't know . But when somebody fills out your contact form , right , or goes and messages you on your social media or on an ad platform , or calls you or walks in , the need has been established . Now you just have to help them buy .

Alan Berg 4:59

So one of the things I'm going to be talking about is how do we sell the results of what we do instead of the services , because they don't really want your services . Think about it Nobody needs a band , nobody needs food , nobody needs chairs , right , they need a place to have an event because they're bringing people together and they want those people to fill in the blank , have a great time , dance , eat , drink and walk away saying it was an amazing time . But those things that we sell , those products and services , are the means to the end , which is how do you want people to feel ? What is the result that's important to them . So that's a lot of what we're going to be talking about and how to articulate that , both in writing , in person , asking better questions , following up One thing that I found I did a presentation at Wedding MBA last year on secret shopping and we secret stopped over 200 companies last year and I got to say that our industry wonderful , creative people really bad at following up . Now what was crazy is almost 20% of the companies we inquired with and I'm talking about going to your website filling out your contact form almost 20% didn't respond at all . I did not even want yeah . So just so you had that . Like what ? What do you mean ? Like you , and I can't imagine ever not replying to someone who inquires , and I would imagine that the businesses that didn't think that they do and want to , but for whatever reason they didn't , and what that means is either there's a technology problem and they never got the inquiry or they were air quotes too busy at that time to reply . But I just did a podcast on my podcast about this . Your customers don't care how busy you are , right when they reach out . The need has been established and they want to reply now . So we're going to talk about my experience of the secret shopping and how that can teach you how to do this better than your competitors , because rarely are we the only ones someone's reaching out to right . I mean , that'd be nice .

Alan Berg 7:01

I actually gotten inquiry today from someone that I've known for years and she's having trouble with her business and she reached out to me and we were able to find a time . She needed it sooner than I had on my calendar , was able to squeeze her in and I said thanks for thinking of me and she wrote me back . She texted me invited with . This whole thing happened through text . I did not try to switch it to a phone call . We're having a great conversation . She texted back you're the only one I thought of . Now , I didn't know that when she reached out , but I treated it that way , even though I didn't know that , because I'm on the short list . Now it happened to be a list of one , which is a great list , but we're not usually that lucky . We're usually the short list of three or five or seven or something like that , and we just have to help them get results .

Alan Berg 7:45

This person didn't reach out to me because they wanted to spend money today . They reached out to me because there was a problem , challenge , crisis , something they're thinking of . They need to sounding board , whatever it happened to be . You know , in this case , their business is down and it's down in significantly from what they would expect it to be now and they're having a panic mode . So I'm going to play part sales consultant , part consultant , part sales trainer , part psychologist , all of those things , because there's a result that they want . The result that they want is to feel more confident about their business and they want to be able to close more sales . And you know , I'm going to dig into that and find that out .

Alan Berg 8:28

But at the point that they reached out , there's something called the zero moment of truth . There was a point where this person said I need help Right Now . At that point , are we on their radar ? So when someone says , like , I have a son who's engaged right now out in California , right , thank you you would think what is it ? The shoemakers , kids have no shoes , right ? You would think they're going to plan way in advance and all this ? No , they want to get married this fall in the Bay Area , right , and it's , as we're recording this , the end of February this year , but next year , this year , right . So I got them a wedding planner because they need help , professional help .

Alan Berg 9:07

People don't know what they don't know . They're also both working and they're busy and all those things , and I said you need help , especially if you want to make this happen this fall . Right , so let's do this . It's one of those things . The two biggest regrets people have after the weddings are in survey after survey not having a wedding planner and not having video . Those are the two things that they regret is not having those two things , and it's because you don't understand the value of the result until you don't have it .

Jared Judge 9:38

It's very true , and that reminds me of an observation I was going to say before , which is regarding sales training and marketing training . Most people in our industry don't actually spend the time and effort to learn it until they recognize they have a need for it . It's not a matter of just like . Let's set ourselves up with the fundamentals so we never have these issues . It's always doctor , I'm bleeding , what do I do ?

Alan Berg 10:04

Exactly , and there are people on our industry that are proactive .

Investing in Continuing Education and Growth

Alan Berg 10:08

And I just looked at something this morning . I was curious with myself when I did my QuickBooks this morning how much did I spend last year on my continuing education ? Now some people would think like , okay , wait a minute , why are you doing continuing education ? You're a certified speaking professional , one of 40 global speaking fellows in the world . You've written 10 books . Why are you doing that ? And the answer is that successful people understand that they don't know everything , and my philosophy is that I don't ever want to be the best I can ever be , but I do want to be the best . I've ever been every time so not including travel , because travel is an extensive part of this I spent over $5,000 last year just on conference fees . That's not including the airfare to get there , the hotels and all that , so we can imagine it's at least double that . But my business , when I look at my top line and my bottom line , is more successful because of that , and some of that is just meeting new people . Some of that is just experiencing things I wouldn't .

Alan Berg 11:11

I'm going to go to four speaker conferences this year three in the US , one in the UK and last year , the one that I went to in the UK they asked me to speak , and not originally , but they asked me to speak afterwards . And it was interesting because I had asked about speaking and they said , no , we have all our speakers . But I donate to what's called the foundation , which , like many things and Nace and Eileen and a lot of these groups have foundations to help people who've fallen on hard times , right , because natural disasters and things like that . So there's one for the speaking world , there's one for the national speakers association this happened to be the one in the UK that's called the PSAUKI , the professional speakers association of the UK and Ireland . So I donated consulting sessions and all the money went to the foundation . Well , after I did a couple of those sessions one of them with the incoming president of the group all of a sudden they asked me to speak , right , so there was no room until they saw results , right , I just said that before was selling results . All of a sudden they're like wait a minute , whatever you just did for me privately , you need to come do that in our conference , because now they experienced those results .

Alan Berg 12:18

Kind of like I was at a wedding a year ago , january , and they had both a band and a DJ both really great . And I'm looking at this DJ thinking he's got this dance floor packed . He owned this room . The only three people who weren't dancing were me , my 93-year-old uncle and my 91-year-old aunt , and I was sitting there with them because I don't get to see them very often , and my uncle ended up passing out that long after . So it was a good thing I did . But I'm watching this dance floor going , wow , this is great . Well , I come to find out that the couple saw him in another wedding . I also turned out that I knew him because I had done a sales training for his company a couple of years before . He looks familiar , but they saw the result and they wanted that result . He was a means to an end . They didn't want the person , they wanted the results of hiring that person .

Alan Berg 13:05

If you can't perceive a difference between results from one company and another , you're going to go with the cheaper company . If you don't perceive there's any benefit of investing in your education , you're not going to do it . And the thing is it's an intangible because , like with me , with my stuff , somebody came up to me at Wedding MBA , and I love when somebody starts a conversation this way Alan , don't take this the wrong way Like , okay , what's coming next here ? And they said I saw you about five years ago and I thought you were a really good speaker , but you're so much better now . And I said , thank you , I don't take that the wrong way . Take it exactly the way you meant it , which was you were good , you're better .

Alan Berg 13:47

Well , that's why I spend so much money investing in my education . That's why I study the craft of what I do , not just the business side and all of that . And what does that mean is I watch other speakers and I go what did she do that was so good ? Or ooh , why did they do that ? Don't do that , right and the same you're a musician , I'm a musician . You watch other musicians and sometimes you're like , wow , that blow my mind . And other times you're like , ooh , I wouldn't have done that right over there , right , unless you're Miles Davis , and then you could get away with it . And if you don't know , miles Davis had a great quote . Somebody said do you ever hit a wrong note ? And he said , yeah , I hit wrong notes all the time . Well , what do you do when you hit a wrong note ? I just keep hitting it until it sounds like I meant to do that .

Alan Berg 14:37

Exactly that's jazz . That is jazz . That is jazz right there . And jazz is improvisation . Well , sometimes we need to be in the orchestra for the classical concert . We have to play every note exactly as it's written on the paper . And there are other times where it's improvisation right , where we have to go with it . When you're meeting with someone to sell them on your services or , as I like to say , help them buy the results of your services , that's improvisation . Sales scripts are like that chart that they're given to a musician you have to play this .

Alan Berg 15:08

When I was in the jazz band in high school , I was the second piano player . Right , there was a guy that was way more technically skilled than I was and classically , you put any piece of music in front of him he could play it . But if you gave him 12 measures to improvise , he didn't know what to do because he needed the music , right . You know people like that . He needed the music . I lived for those 12 measures . I wanted that improvisation . And the teacher hands me this chart and he says , okay , this is it , this is you're going to be the lead . I said , okay , I have to play this . He goes yeah , I said exactly this . He said yeah . I said every time he said yeah .

Alan Berg 15:46

Well , that is like when I started in the industry . I was trained air quotes here . I was trained with a manual , this big three-ring binder with all these page sleeve things , and I was supposed to go out and do sales and literally go front to back in this book . And I had already been in sales for 10 years before that . I'm scratching my head , going that's what we do , like that's what you're supposed to do , like go through that . And she's my trainer . She's like yes , this is what you do . Well , she went back to the main office and I put the manual away because that's not how you sell .

Alan Berg 16:19

You're not listening . If you're going through A to Z , you're no better than the tram driver at Disney and on your right is Magic Mountain and you're left the Cinderella's castle . And what we have to learn is we learn by listening , not by talking . My most popular book if you're seeing this over my shoulder there's three orange covers . It's shut up and sell more weddings and events . And that's because we learn by listening . When we're talking , we know everything we're about to say . So one of the things I like to teach in my training and in the workshop is what does listening mean ? What are better questions to ask that will get us better answers , to get people feeling different things , and that's a lot of what we're going to cover .

Jared Judge 17:01

Yeah , that sounds amazing . You don't have the time to go through all of that , and if our listeners want to get all of it , then they got to come to our meeting and event April 9th at the Gaylord Rockies , which you can go and get a ticket at nacedenfordcom . But I'd love to continue . I've heard so many amazing lessons from you , and some of them maybe you didn't even intend as lessons such as you know , it was combined with the mystery shopping of other vendors , but even just watching what other people in our industry are doing , like when you're watching speakers , you're noticing . These are the good things that I would love to incorporate into what I do . These are the not so good things that I would like to avoid doing . We , as wedding and events vendors , should do more of that , because we can't get stuck in our own ways , and that's just not a great way to progress and match the times . You look like you were about to say something .

Alan Berg 17:54

Yeah , I mean we have to look outside of our industry sometimes for the good ideas , because otherwise we're only hearing the same

Improving Customer Experience Through Friction Analysis

Alan Berg 18:01

things . We're in our echo chamber and I listened to a lot of audio books . I love to read a book , but I would read one or two paperback books a year and , according to audible , I read 44 audio books last year . Now I don't know that I finished them all . I know I started 44 . Some of them , yeah , maybe not , and some of them were just I'm still reading because they were just longer and sometimes you just see something somewhere else and you go , okay , how can I adapt that for what I do ? And the idea is not to copy what your competitors are doing or copy what someone else is doing in the industry , but what can you learn from that and what is it about that ? That's different , because what we don't want to do is be a clone of someone else , because then there's no perceived difference between you and them . So , looking around you , for instance , when you're a customer , I did a presentation the other day about reducing the friction in your sales process and I started by just telling stories about when I was a customer , just things that companies did that just added friction to the process .

Alan Berg 19:06

Like I have a car , I have an Audi and I bought it used , so I didn't have the service manual . My mechanic said , hey , you should change the spark plugs . I was like , is that the time ? So I looked in the glove box there was no schedule in there . I went to the Audi website okay , put in your VIN number , great . And then I go to get the service manual and it said put in your VIN number . Like I did that , like I did that to register and log in . And then I got to the next step and guess what it asked me .

Alan Berg 19:33

VIN number , put in your VIN number , like , really , three times . I'm already logged in , like don't you know my VIN number here ? And then you have the opposite of that , where they make it so easy for you . And we could talk about Amazon and all the things that they do by now and all things like that that make it easy for us , but are we paying attention to that , right ?

Alan Berg 19:53

So I went through this whole list of things that frustrate me or that I don't like , like , do you like paying a credit card fee when you use a credit card ? No , okay , I have an Apple watch and an iPhone and I love paying with Apple Pay . Right , paying with my watch or stuff like that . Well , big companies like Walmart , home Depot , lowe's they don't have tap . Like , you can't tap your credit card , you can't use Apple Pay . I'm thinking really , like , these are big companies You're not talking about . You know the local store Actually , the local store I'm more likely to be able to tap than I am at those big stores .

Alan Berg 20:28

Well , that's frustrating , especially the time when I ran out of the house without my wallet and run over to Home Depot for the fifth time . If you do any home improvements , you know what that's like for the fifth time and I don't have my wallet and I can't pay for this thing that I need because I can't pay with my phone , I can't pay with my watch , which you know I could do elsewhere . But then I turned it around and said how many of these things that I just said and I went through a whole bunch of things how many of these things that I said are you doing to your customers ? How many decisions did you make in your business ? Because it's easier for you . That don't make it easier for them . Right ?

Alan Berg 21:05

I just did my taxes and I will complain to my accountant once again . They send a tax organizer which has all what you did last year or this is this year , and I have to print it and handwrite it and scan it and upload it . Now , fortunately , I have all that technology , but really I can't just type this number Like you're gonna rely on my handwriting for this stuff here . That's frustrating . Now , I love the accountant , so I go through it . It's only once a year that I have to do it . But really why do I have to go through this Now ?

Alan Berg 21:39

I take for granted everybody's got a printer , because I have four printers sitting next to me here , I realized a while back that my two millennial sons , they don't have printers . My son who's engaged , he doesn't have a printer . His fiance doesn't have a printer . My other son and his partner , they don't have printers . So are you asking any of your couples , any of your customers , whether they're corporate or not , to print something out , handwrite it , sign it , scan it , send it back to you in 2024 ? Why are you doing that ?

Jared Judge 22:09

Right , and that's a really great point , Like a broader point would be are you asking people for feedback on the way you conduct your business ? I once discovered this website called user testingcom , where you could hire a couple of random people to perform a task , whatever you want them to do , and they will record themselves on Zoom or video of them going through your website , submitting an inquiry form , interacting with your salespeople , and you'll hear all the embarrassing details of this is where they got stuck . Oh man , I'm just . It's very eye-opening .

Alan Berg 22:47

I don't know if you've ever I was gonna say you look pained .

Jared Judge 22:50

Just relating that my face definitely got redder because it is a painful experience . I've done it , obviously , yes , but like it is painful , but that's the way to grow .

Alan Berg 23:00

Right , we can't see things through other people's eyes . I did a podcast . If you can't take a , you can't walk a mile in their shoes at least take a few steps . And that's some of those things I'm researching for a presentation I'm doing next week . One of the few that I do outside the industry it's actually for senior living facilities , because the person that owns those companies also owns wedding venues and they brought me over training for that and going through their website , clicking to read about them , to understand what their customers go through . Just like you said , I found a broken link Right , so I did a screenshot , I circled it , I sent them the link , I sent it over because they're not doing that .

Alan Berg 23:37

They're not going to their site and clicking on every link . We're doing secret shopping . Now this group inquired with us . They have eight venues in another state not in Colorado , in another state and I said to my assistant okay , go secret shop them . Well , the only way to make an inquiry is through an email or to book a tour , so there was no form . For I'd like to ask a question Now . They do have pricing on their website . It's I don't think it's exact pricing . I think it's pretty close , like they're saying with the average or something like that . So to say , I like your pricing and packages . It's kind of on their website already . Doesn't mean it's clear , but it's on their website .

Alan Berg 24:17

But she said I can't inquire separately for these venues without booking tours . To me that's a friction point . If somebody just wants to ask you something , I don't know , is it handicap compatible ? Did you have , I don't know whatever . Do you have valet parking ? Can you handle ? You know , seliak , friendly meals or whatever it is . The only way to do that is to send an email and you're sending it to the general inbox . There's eight different venues and you can't say this one , I want to send an email to that one . Well , I'm sure they don't think they're adding friction because it's easier for them if people would just book tours , right , right , that's whatever venue wants . What they don't realize is the inquiries they may not be getting , because people don't want to book a tour and you know there really isn't another easy way to do that and they'll say well , here's my phone number , here's my email , that's easy . Yeah , you know what Contact forms are easier for people .

Alan Berg 25:10

They guide them , they make it easier . I have a short contact form on every page of my website on the side and then a contact page which the spammers use . The ones on the side of the page the real people use . No joke , jared 98 out of 100 inquiries through my actual contact page for somebody trying to sell me something or spam . The ones on the side of the page almost never are spam because the spammers are looking for your contact page , they're not looking for a form on a page . So that was a way actually cut down on the spam and I can tell when it comes in and it says contact form it's gonna be . What was the one today ? Cleaning services . I don't know if I needed cleaning services .

Jared Judge 25:52

Yeah , I got the same one . I was like you don't want to clean my apartment .

Alan Berg 25:57

Right . So again , are we walking a mile in their shoes ? Are we understanding what their journey is like ? It's hard when you have the curse of knowledge If you've been doing this for months , weeks , years , decades to know what it's like for someone that has never done this , right To take that step and to say again , go back to that Zemout .

Alan Berg 26:17

The zero moment of truth when somebody says , okay , we're planning a fill in the blank Graduation party , we're planning a corporate event , we're planning a fundraiser , we're planning a mitzvah , keen , say , a wedding , whatever it is , we need stuff . If they've done it before , great , they know where to start . If they've never done it before , what do we do ? What do we do ? And then , what do we need ? And it's not as confusing for us as it is for them , because think about just a venue . Are you renting four walls ? Does it come with tables and chairs ? Do I have to hire a caterer ? Do I have to use your caterer ? Is it preferred list of caterers ? And then , when we get into catering , is it's buffet or stations are plated right ? And then , what about the bar ? Do I have to bring in my own bartender ? Can I buy my liquor or not ?

Alan Berg 27:02

We take for granted that oh yeah , we know how to do this . But they don't . And I think a lot of people in the industry , if they've turned the table , like , how many people do we know that ? Then they get engaged and then they have to plan their wedding , maybe out of state , right ? So it's not the friends that they know , it's not all their connections that they have , and I hear this all the time . I just heard this from someone in Connecticut getting married into Jersey . She's like I found this florist I loved , I reached out and she didn't get back to me . So she reached out again . The customer reached out again , not the customer's job . The customer reached out again and the florist was like , oh yeah , we're really busy with events right now . I don't care , I want information for my wedding . Right , that's what she's thinking .

Jared Judge 27:45

Yeah , exactly what I'm hearing from you is we truly have to embrace being the expert that guides these people . Right , like your book Shut Up and Sell More Stuff . Or what was the newest book , which we haven't even talked about , which is Stop Selling and Help your Customers Buy Weddings and Events ? Right , we just have to help them and be their expert . I know so many people who are just unwilling to be that expert . They're just like my services should just sell themselves , but they don't .

Alan Berg 28:13

Well , you hear it a lot photographers . Well , you know , if they love my work , they'll hire me . You know what ? There's a lot of quality photographers out there that do really , really good work . But what's lacking on most photographers' websites ? And I've consulted , I do website reviews , I've consulted on many photographers .

Photography and Customer Experience

Alan Berg 28:32

They all kind of look the same and when I don't take this the wrong way but they can't tell the difference between your pictures and the next photographer because their eye is different than yours . I did this the other day in a workshop in Las Vegas . There was a photographer and I said , okay , so you use Canon or Nikon or Sony or what he goes , I use Sony . I said , right , and nobody cares . And everybody laughed and he's like right , I said because they care if the pictures are beautiful . But see , when he looks at a picture of another photographer , he's looking at the use of light and shadow and composition and all those things . And he might say , hey , what lens was that and what were the settings on that lens and all that kind of stuff . And somebody else looks at that picture and goes I don't know if I choose those flowers , right , right , because they're looking at that wedding , not looking and critiquing the photography . Right , it's an emotion . I like the photography . I don't why . I don't know that picture speaks to me or it doesn't , but I wouldn't wear that dress , oh . Or that dress is beautiful , or you know that venue , where was that ? And they're thinking about that and he's thinking about but what about my use of shadow ? Right .

Alan Berg 29:41

And the other thing is , you're going to spend an awful lot of time with your photographer , from before the wedding to getting ready , through the ceremony , through the cocktails , through the reception , through , you know , whenever the photographer leaves , whatever point that is . You also want to like them , right , you want to have a connection with them and this person pointing their camera at you and you want to be smiling genuinely and not thinking this person's a jerk , right , and this is part of that , that , that intangible , that they don't think about , they'll . If they get it wrong , they will know . And if they get it right and this is why the presentation I could be doing at the evening meeting about your branding versus your brand , your brand is in your reviews . All right , that's the short story . I'll tell you that . And when you read photographer reviews , you read them talking about the photographer , not just the photography . When you read band reviews or DJ reviews or venue reviews , right , or officiant reviews or whatever , you read them talking about people and you talk about experiences . And I'm going to talk about the experience from that Zemot , that first moment that they have any idea that they need what you do , till when their first exposure to you through , when they have conversations with you , till they book you , till the wedding and after , till the corporate event , the holiday party , whatever you know , it's all experiential , right , and that's what it is .

Alan Berg 31:02

We had an HVAC unit put in our bedroom , made our house into an extra zone , so we didn't have to cool the whole house to cool the bedroom . And the company we went with they were all . They couldn't tell me the equipment was better because three companies came and handed me the same brochure , right , the same Fujitsu brochure circled , the same 15,000 BTU unit . You can't tell me yours is better than the next one , because they're all the same . Yeah , but only one company followed up . And then when I asked them a question , they responded right away . And if I texted or if I emailed or if I called right away , well , who did I go with ? That company , right , and then when we needed something else done . I was going to reach out to different companies . I said let me go to them first .

Alan Berg 31:42

And when push came to shove it at the end , I said you know what ? I really don't want to shop around . And I went back and this little sales thing as a customer that I do , we all want to know we got the best price and we all want to know that customer won't get a better price . And I say never fault somebody for asking for a better price . You don't have to give it , right ? I just had somebody asked me that the other day and I gave him wording for that . So I went back to the guy and I said listen , there's a lot of companies around here that can do this . I really don't want to shop around . What can you do to have me not shop around ? And he came back and he did something for me . Now he didn't have to kind of want to go with him anyway , right , and I probably would have gone with him anyway , because then I know that I got the best price . Well , instead I got $300 off . So there you go , and the idea is that company has already proven to me that they're responsive , they're reliable .

Alan Berg 32:36

The workman that came and did the work , followed through for the person that made the sale , because that's often in our business as well . Right , the person selling you that venue isn't the person cooking your food , right , well , maybe sometimes , but rarely is that the case . And sometimes , if the entertainment company , the person that books , may not be the person doing the entertainment , and so forth . So we have brands that have feelings , brands that have voices . Right , like , the target's voice is different than Macy's and Taco Bell's voice is different than Panera , right , so brands have voices .

Alan Berg 33:08

Do you know your brand's voice ? Does that come through in your communication ? Too often I see the communication that just seems stiff , like your ninth grade English teachers looking over your shoulder , going Jared , that's not proper grammar , that's not how we speak and you're like right , that's not how I speak . Exactly , this is how I speak and therefore that's how I write , whether it's a text or an email or whatever on my website . This is how I write . Or does it sound like the SEO people ? You know those websites with the SEO people were there first .

Jared Judge 33:38

Yes , looking for a wedding band near you .

Alan Berg 33:41

Right , if you're looking for a Denver wedding band , then you need a band in Denver that does weddings , because wedding bands in Denver exactly , it's like Rain man , you know , definitely , definitely , definitely needs to say that . So , getting out of your head and looking at your own business the way other people do and this is actually a good way to do this is to pick a buddy and go look at their site , go look at their marketing , go look at their things preferably some of where you've never seen their stuff and then have them do like you said with that testing . Have them go look at your stuff and go like I know you , but this doesn't look like you , or this doesn't feel like you , or this doesn't sound like you , and then , when you do what you said , which is , you know , look at the competitors , look and see what they're doing . You know , just because they're doing it doesn't mean it's working Right and it doesn't mean it's right for your business and your brand and those things .

Alan Berg 34:32

I see a lot of things that other speakers and consultants and trainers do that I won't do . Maybe it works for them , I don't know . For instance , the picture on my homepage what do you typically see with a speaker . There's the speaker up on stage . Now mine is me on stage but shot from behind me so that the faces or the audience faces , not mine Now you can tell that it's me . If you've seen me , I'm bald and there I am , okay , great , and it's kind of a three quarter shot so you can still see that it's me , but it's me on stage because of those people . I didn't need to be there if those people weren't coming very much . Like you know , the videographer doesn't need to be there if there was no event , the photographer doesn't need to be there . If there's no offense , the officiant doesn't need to be there .

Alan Berg 35:18

And for most of the events that we do , they're happy occasions , right , other than you know , maybe celebrations of life , which is the happy , sad one , right , they're happy occasions . So people are bringing us in because they want to . It's totally discretionary money . There's no law in this country or actually I've spoken in 14 countries there's no law in anywhere in the world that says you have to throw a party when you get married or when your kid turns 13 or 16 or 15 or whatever .

Alan Berg 35:45

There's no law that says a company has to have a holiday party or a customer appreciation event or that you know charities have to throw fundraisers . There's no law yes , they have to raise money , but there's no law that says they have to do it . They could just keep asking for money , right , like that's the other stuff you get in your inbox , right ? All the people asking for money . So when we're brought in as the event industry , it's almost always a happy occasion and it's discretionary , which means people are doing this because they want to . What are the kind of results that we can bring them ? So they'll say at the end , that was worth every penny , even when it's more than they wanted to spend , which most of the time it is right , and you know why that is Jared . What do you think ?

Jared Judge 36:32

Let me think about that . Why so ?

Alan Berg 36:33

the question is why do people spend more than they originally intend ?

Jared Judge 36:39

because the person that they were speaking to created the desire for it .

Alan Berg 36:44

Because the results they want cost more than the budget they set .

Jared Judge 36:48

There you go .

Alan Berg 36:49

But when they set the budget , they didn't know that . Because , especially if they've never done it before , right , what does fill in the blank cost if you've never bought it before ? You don't know ? It's called framing . We frame current decisions from past experience . So if you were going to go buy a new , you're a musician yourself . Yep , what's your main interest , violinist ? Okay , you're going to go buy a new violin . You have an idea what violins cost , right , and you might say , okay , inflation , or it's been a while , or I want something that has , you know , different features than the one before . I want one of those clear ones that I can , you know , light up with different colors or whatever it is right . You're going to say , okay , I have an idea . Now what if you've never done that ? What if you , as a violinist , said , okay , I'm going to go buy a baritone saxophone .

Jared Judge 37:40

Yeah , I'd be completely guessing .

Alan Berg 37:42

Right Now , when we guess we got to try to use some information we might have and say , okay , instruments , there we go . Right , and we're probably going to be wrong because we didn't have anything to base it on . Okay , so now you put yourself in the shoes of someone planning an event . What does catering cost ? Well , technically it goes from I'm not going to say free , because if you do it yourself , it's the cost of the food till you know , whatever it's like . What is eating out cost ? Right , I can go to the what is it ? The Brown Palace ? Or I can go to the Buckhorn Exchange , or I can go to Taco Bell . Right , Exactly Right . So this range .

Alan Berg 38:22

They come up with a number and say , okay , this feels about , right , this is what my son and his fiance are going through right now . I don't know what their budget is , right , they did say that they would like to have a band , but it's probably going to bust their budget , which is why we just told them that we're going to pay for the band , because my parents did that for our wedding and you know , this saves them money for other stuff . So they're going to get what they want , but not in their budget , right ? So their budget is not going to allow for that , Okay , well , now they're going to be able to get it .

Alan Berg 38:52

Everything else , I don't know what their budget is for venue , for catering , for those things , right , that's up to them to decide . And if we decide to help anymore , that's up to us , right ? And I told my wife . I said we're not going to tell them what we're going to do until they figure out what they want , right ? A friend of mine , when his son got engaged , he said I want to help . Do I just say that I'll pay a third because it was the bride's parents ? He's the father of the groom , the bride's parents and then the couple paying . I said do you want to be a blank check ?

Jared Judge 39:21

Exactly .

Alan Berg 39:22

If you want to be a blank check , knock yourself out . I said what I would do is either pay for certain services or write them a check for whatever you feel comfortable . Let them do what they want . If it happens to be half , great , and if it's 10% , fine . That's up to them to decide what they want .

Alan Berg 39:37

But , according to the knot , couples go over their wedding budgets by well the ones that do , which is over half of them by 30 to 50% . And the way I say that is it's because they picked a number out of thin air and then they said these are the services we want . So this is the venue , this is the caterer , this is the photographer , the videographer , the music , the flowers , the clothing , the jewelry , the efficient , the invitations , the transportation . The average wedding has 12 to 14 services , right ? So all of these things . That's not including the honeymoon . Then we got the honeymoon on top of that . And when you pick that number out , I could use any of the tools online and it says okay , what's your budget ? Boom , you put the number and it says okay , which of these services do you want ? Most couples are like all of them , I want all of them . And then you wonder why it says you only have X for whatever that service is , because the money only goes so far if you divide it by all those things .

Effective Sales Strategies for Results

Alan Berg 40:30

So our job is not to sell to someone's budget . Our job is to find out the results that they want , or present them with the results they didn't even know they could have , and then tell them how much it will cost to get to those results and let them decide if they want to do that or not . That's what I call top down selling . We sell to the results , not to the budget , right ? Too many people sell from the bottom up , which is they try to sell low service and then more and more and more and more , and then you run into decision fatigue and decision paralysis . And then people if you hear this a lot , you've given us so much to think about . Right , if you hear that a lot , you're gonna hear it once in a while , but if you hear it a lot , it's your fault because you have given them too much to think about as opposed to just enough to say Jared , I want you and your team to come . I want you , I want the experience that you're gonna do . I did a podcast . Are your results really better or are they just different ?

Alan Berg 41:25

And a lot of people in our industry would like to say that our results are better . And I'll say , well , we'll never know , because that event is only gonna happen once , no matter what the event is Now , if it's a corporation or a fundraiser or a school , they might have other events , but that particular event is only gonna happen once . So that wedding , that mitzvah , that kinsay , that birthday party , that graduation , whatever it is . So how will we know if your results were better if there was nobody else doing what you did ? So there was no other musicians , there was no other aficiant , there was no other caterer . It was only at that one venue .

Alan Berg 41:57

Unless we go to the sci-fi world , right , if we all of a sudden , you know , have parallel universes with two of the same event going on and the only thing different was you versus somebody that does something like you . Maybe then we could tell which would better . But otherwise it's their perception that your results will be better and they want your results and therefore they have to pay your price . And all those companies that are getting higher dollars , it's people perceive that the results they're gonna get are the ones they want , because they will be better than somebody else's , but it has to be a perception , because it can never be a reality .

Jared Judge 42:32

Right , and that right there is one of the biggest arguments for becoming better at sales , because it doesn't matter how good your product is if nobody has a chance to experience it .

Alan Berg 42:42

Right , and you know the best thing is if someone has experienced what you do , then they can say okay , I know what it's like to have you fill in the blank to eat your catering , to be at your venue , to see you officiate a wedding right , to get your invitation in the mail . I know what that's like . But for a lot of us it's just selling that idea . And that comes back to the asking better questions to help them buy . So it wasn't my first book , but my first sales book stop shut up and sell more weddings and events . That book was to teach you to stop talking and listen . And I said if I ever write another book , it's gonna be sales book . It's gonna be called Stop Selling and Help them Buy . And the reason is you don't need to sell somebody who is already a buyer . You're not trying to convince them to buy services like yours . You're trying to convince them that yours are the services and results that they want . But they're already a buyer .

Alan Berg 43:37

In a previous life , over 30 years ago , I was in the car business and people don't walk into a car dealership because they need bread , right , they walk into a car dealership because they either need today or will need or thinking about at some point that they want a car . And what I learned is don't sell them the car they sat in because , let's face it , if it's a red convertible in the middle of the showroom floor , most of us are gonna go sit in it and have a moment . And then you find out that in my case I was selling mini vans and stuff like that , that baby number four is on the way and that red convertible isn't happening for at least 18 years , right ? So stop trying to sell them that and just ask better questions what did you come looking for today ? How can I ? What is it that I can help you find ? Like , when you walk in a store and somebody says can I help you ? That's a bad question . What can I help you find is a better question .

Challenging Customer Perceptions and Sales

Alan Berg 44:32

I travel a lot . I mean a lot . I think I drove 5,000 miles last year , but I flew 100,000 . So I'm in hotels , a lot of restaurants , and I always get a kick when I walk into a hotel dragging two suitcases behind me , walk up to the front desk and the person says how can I help you ? You know I need a sandwich , right ? Like , how do you think you can help me . Now if they say checking in , right , it's still pretty obvious , but that's a better question . And it's like , how can I help you ? What do you think here Right now , if I walk in with no bags , walk up to the desk , maybe that's a better question . But seriously , just walked in from outside , clearly out of breath , dragging these suitcases behind me , and you say , how can I help you ?

Alan Berg 45:20

That , to me , is not good customer service , but happens all the time . If you think about it , people that do that , you know , ask you the wrong question . That will not get you closer to the right information or the right answer . Right , it happens to us all the time . Well , let's turn ourselves around again . Are we doing that to customers ?

Alan Berg 45:40

When we were clearing out my dad's apartment after he passed , we found two film canisters and we couldn't tell if they had been exposed or not , cause it was this film called APS , which doesn't have the little leader out when it's not exposed , so it puts it out and back . And got really excited , like , maybe there's pictures on here right From years ago . Where do you even get it developed anymore , right ? So we go to CVS and they have film . Great , drop it off , okay , and I said so how long does this take ? And the young lady goes I don't know , and that was it . She didn't say anything else . I'm thinking , not , I don't know , let me go find out . Like just , I don't know , right , but that again that happens to us as businesses . Are we doing things like that to our customers or are we trying to get to the root ? There's a great book called the Challenger Sale , where you challenge someone on the results that they're asking for , with results that they couldn't have imagined .

Alan Berg 46:38

And the way I explained it very simply is people can't ask for what they don't know exists . That's true . If you've seen it , you've heard about it , whatever , what was Steve Jobs so good at was coming up with these things that we couldn't imagine and now can't live without , right . I remember the first iPad . I was like who needs that ? I think I'm on my fifth or sixth right , who needs that ? I'm on my fifth or sixth Apple Watch , the old Dick Tracy wrist radio .

Alan Berg 47:08

From there you go from way , way back . What was that ? In the 30s or 40s or whatever , they perceived that if they're Star Trek , think about all the things on Star Trek that were props . The flip phone right , the communicator became the flip phone . They don't have it yet . But what was the Doctor Bones ? Right , mccoy , he had that thing that you could just go over you and tell you what was wrong with you . Oh yeah , I heard that that was actually a salt shaker that they turned into this thing that he did there . But all these things , but your customers can't ask for what they don't know exists , right . So , like what you do with violin , if someone's vision of a violinist is classical music , right , classical , baroque , whatever it is , they can't imagine you doing contemporary music .

Alan Berg 47:53

I remember sitting in a where are we ? We were in a B&B in South Carolina , hilton Head , south Carolina , having afternoon tea . It was very nice afternoon years ago and listening to the music and it was a string quartet and I said that's the Rolling Stones , that's sympathy for the devil . It was the Hampton string quartet and it was the first time I'd ever heard that . To me , string quartets were Ina Klana , nock music . String quartets were classical music . And I'm hearing this and it blew my mind because I know that song I've never heard it played like that . Okay , now , expanded mind . Now what else can I hear like that ? What other songs can I hear like that what would it sound like if they did the doors ? If they did , you know whatever ? And now you can't unknow that . That's the curse of knowledge . You can't unknow that your customers don't have the curse of knowledge because they don't have that experience .

Jared Judge 48:48

Exactly Reminds me . I do a lot of sales consultations for my own services and oftentimes I'll ask , like what's your dream wedding ? What specifically with the music ? What are you imagining ? And they'll describe to me very simply we're just looking for background music while our guests are seated and walking down the aisle and like that's all Really . Then I paint this picture , I tell them the story , that oftentimes when I tell the story , if the mom of the bride's on the call she'll start crying . And then I've expanded their mind . Like music is no longer just background , it is the emotional intensity of your moment , catered to the exact occasion .

Alan Berg 49:29

Music is memory , Food is memory , Vision is smells they're all memory . We all have that . When somebody says , like , what song was playing when ? Right ? And then you go back to that memory , and these are . Every decision we make is emotionally involved . People that have the part of their brain that's damaged that controls emotion can't make basic decisions like what to wear and what to eat , Even when you think these are not emotional decisions . Every decision we make is emotional .

Alan Berg 50:00

So what you're trying to do again is not sell your services , Because if you sell your services , somebody sells them cheaper . It's always gonna be the case . Or , as I like to say , when you were new in business , it was you that sold the cheaper right , and now you don't right , and that's the case with all of us . I charge , I think , five times what I did in 2011 or 12 when I started with my business , when I left the knot and the idea of well , people won't pay that . Well , they'll pay that if you believe in the results that you provide and the value , and if you're talking to the right customers , because there were always people that can't afford what you do , and if you raise your price , they still can't afford what you do . But the people that are paying your price might pay more . And how do you know ? Raise your price and then you'll find out . And that's what I like to play that game with my customers and my audience as well is to challenge them and prove to them that everybody in the room can raise their price . And there are people like no , no , no , I can't raise my price . So I was like you can , you can , I'll prove it to you , I'll prove it to you . The question is how much . It's not whether you can raise it . Yeah , for sure it's how much . But you have to believe it , right ? You have to be able to say that .

Alan Berg 51:10

One of the things I'm asked most often when I do sales training is can you teach my people not to sell with their own wallet ? It's not your money , it's their money , right ? And if you let the customer buy your results with their wallet , people will pay for things that you personally wouldn't pay for , right ? I remember doing a mastermind in Richmond , Virginia , and this high-end decor designer sitting next to me . She goes I wouldn't pay my prices . I was like what she said I would never hire somebody to do what I do because I can do it . So I can't imagine ever paying this kind of money to do something like that . I said do your customers have problems paying your price ? She goes oh no , not at all . Right , that's the point . It's not her money , it's their money .

Alan Berg 51:56

Just go to a parking lot . What do you see ? You see cheap beat up cars and you see brand new , high-end cars . Somebody paid and let them decide what they wanna do . You don't have to drive a new Ferrari to sell someone one , or drive a Rolls Royce to sell someone , or live in a $5 million house to sell someone a $5 million house . It's their money . They get to decide . And , by the way , that realtor selling the $5 million house doesn't apologize and go oh Jared , it's $5 million . They say it's only $5 million , there's only one like this . Should we get that written up now ?

Jared Judge 52:30

Yeah , it all stems from belief , which this is kind of the . Unfortunately , we're running out of time for this podcast . I'm having so much fun . I have learned a lot . It's just really nice to dive deep into these concepts , which it's not something that we talk about enough , and I really appreciate it . I feel like we're just scratching the surface of what you can share your wealth of knowledge and expertise . I wanted to dive deeper into websites . We don't have time for that , but I imagine we'll touch on that at the April 9th meeting at the Gaylord Rockies Convention Center . Is that correct ?

Alan Berg 53:07

Absolutely . And you just have to think to yourself whatever the investment is , if you don't come , you won't learn anything . Nothing will change . You'll keep doing what you're doing and whatever is your biggest challenge right now , whatever that is closing more sales , converting leads , getting people to phone calls and tours , getting ghosted less whatever If you lose one sale because you didn't come and learn something right , that's gonna cost you more than whatever the ticket is .

Alan Berg 53:36

So it's one day , it's April 9th . What is that ? A Tuesday ? It's in the afternoon , and then stick around for the evening for the branding one in the evening . There you could spend more time on social media or you could come and learn something that's gonna help your business . And those are the skills that just keep building and keep growing with you , where , if you learn how to close one more sale , that's gonna turn into you closing another one and another one and another one . I'll leave you with the one last story . Yesterday , unsolicited , it got reached out to me that had done something just like this , that had done a class like this with me years ago , and he said I was just thinking about you . Today again , I don't know why , maybe saw something on social . Whatever , he said , I just wanted to reach out and let you know that that was the best investment that I ever made , and this year we're gonna hit our annual sales goal in the first quarter .

Jared Judge 54:27

It's amazing .

Alan Berg 54:28

Right Now . I didn't do that . I gave him tools to do that and then he did that . We can't make you come to this event , but if you come to this event and you don't hear at least one idea that you can use right away , you aren't paying attention . I mean , that's what it is . There's gonna be so much information there , besides the people around you , right , besides the value of networking and all that . So I'm with you , jared . I wish we had more time , because this is just so much fun , as you can tell . I think you and I could do this all day . Oh , absolutely .

Jared Judge 54:57

Well , thank you so much for being on this episode . For our listeners who are interested in coming and hearing Alan for a lot longer than this one hour episode , go to nasedenvercom . That's N-A-C-E stands for National Association for Catering and Events , nasedenvercom . Right on the homepage you'll see the April 9th event . You can get your tickets before they sell out , which I am sure they will , and I just can't wait to meet you in person . So thank you so much , alan .

Alan Berg 55:23

Maybe we can jam one of them out there .

Jared Judge 55:26

That'd be awesome . Bring your keyboard .

Alan Berg 55:28

I got one here for you there we go there we go , looking forward to it . Thanks , jared .

Jared Judge 55:31

Likewise Thank you so much for listening to another episode of the Denver Nace podcast . See you on April 9th .